Question & Poll

Post by **jem** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 3:04 pm

it's a fine line to dance on.

If a customer builds one, is not happy with the quality, I'm not going to fuss about building another especially if it's their first boat.

If a customer builds one, loves it, sends me pictures and gives feedback, then we work something out. Sometimes no charge, sometimes a percentage of the original cost of plans, sometimes and agreement to purchase build materials through one of my supply partners, etc, etc. it all depends on the design and circumstances.

That "one boat" rule helps me stay in contact with my customers. So when they are ready to build another, I can speak with them directly and get a feel for what they liked and disliked.

It also makes sure I'm getting credit for my work. It's protection from the very few who would take advantage of the situation.

Hank · Post by **Hank** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:07 pm

Let's do some math with some made up numbers for a mythical 3 sheet boat:

Plans: $40
Wood (the nice kind): 3 x $50
Resin, glass, wood flour, etc: $300

Total: $490 or lets round to $500.

The plans are around 8% of the out-of-pocket for the boat. But without the plans you don't have a boat to build. If you like a design enough to build a second one, sending the designer $40 (or whatever the plans actually cost) is an excellent way of saying "Thank you for designing such a delightful boat."

- Hank

hairymick · Post by **hairymick** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:25 pm

Heya Hank,

bloody good onya mate. My thoughts exactly! only you managed to say them in many fewer words. Matts plans are real cheap anyway compared to some of the other big name mobs and he is much better to do business with.

Kayak Jack · Post by **Kayak Jack** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:07 pm

That's why I added the caveat that if it is part of the original agreement, then yes. Matt's gotta eat too.

Whether Matt or not, what are the group's feeling if there are no requirements stated when you buy the plans?

Post by **jem** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:27 pm

Kayak Jack wrote: Whether Matt or not, what are the group's feeling if there are no requirements stated when you buy the plans?

That's a different situation. Now I don't want to speak for other designers but to me, you need to state how you do business up front.

Tradition with many designers has been one hull for one set of plans. I don't know the entire history behind that. I do understand the work it takes just to do a small canoe or kayak properly. It takes much more to do a larger craft.

To put that much time and effort in make you want to get value for your skills and time. Look at things on a larger scale: Plans that cost $500-$1000 and take 200+ hours to draw. Designer will definitely looking for payment for each hull built.

Kayak Jack · Post by **Kayak Jack** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:53 pm

I'm also thinking that a set of plans gets a bit messed up in the process. On a simple, all-symmetrical boat, once a guy builds one, then all he needs are the numbers to draw the panels. On a complex boat - a SOT comes to mind - I'd definitely want a clean set for each craft, whether it had been a pre-condition or not.

Wimperdink · Post by **Wimperdink** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:46 pm

Kayak Jack wrote:That's why I added the caveat that if it is part of the original agreement, then yes. Matt's gotta eat too.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Kayak Jack wrote:Whether Matt or not, what are the group's feeling if there are no requirements stated when you buy the plans?

In this case, you paid for them, and now you own them.

I agree with what you said Jack, " if it is part of the original agreement, then yes." Then you pay for each and every boat you build, practice boat or otherwise.

I typed wayyyyy to much stuff then just started deleting until I ended up with those feeble comments.

Is that a sign of getting old?

Momo · Post by **Momo** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 9:14 pm

Good question.
Very thought provoking.
Momo

Kayak Jack · Post by **Kayak Jack** » Sun Feb 18, 2007 1:08 am

Wimperdink wrote:... I typed wayyyyy to much stuff then just started deleting until I ended up with those feeble comments. Is that a sign of getting old?

It's a good start, WD. Maybe you qualify for a GIT button. (Geezer In Training)

gken · Post by **gken** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:01 pm

I dont know much about the industry from Matt's perspective, but I can tell you from mine that I would be willing to pay for the plans for every boat I make aslong as I am going to have a quality product in the end. I dont think the money is so much a complement to the designer as it is respect for what they've done. Matt has made boat building available to those of us that are not so mechinically inclined to design a craft that will float. What I am trying to say is that it is worth paying for his knowlege. It is the same delema you face at McDonalds... You paid for the cup of soda, does that give you the right to free refills? Or should you pay for another soda? --Garrett

JEM Watercraft

Question & Poll

If you purchase a set of boat plans from a designer, should you pay the designer/seller every time you build another boat from that same set of plans?